What to buy? Fanatec CSW or T500RS

[Ilias Axarlis]

I'm thinking to buy CSW base with the gt2 rim and the v2 pedals, I'm actualy between this and the T500 RS, but I have found reports for bad reliability on fanatec products but there are all 1 year ago. Is there any new feedback on this? Have they fixed the problems or they are still there?

 

[Leemstradamus]

UFwho, it's a shame your still experiencing issues with the CSW base, have you contacted Fanatec for advice on the new motor issues yet, maybe Fanatec will get you to post it back to them and they can then fix the issue once and for all. Cant hurt to ask them mate.

I would say that Fanatec, like any company that releases a new product, is going to have some teething problems. Sure Fanatec are getting a bad wrap over these issues with the CSW line of sim gear, but look at their previous history with their older releases, GT2 wheel or the GT3 RS wheel or the CSR or Elite pedals, there have been little to no issues with these products since they ironed out the initial bugs, I can see the same occurring with the CSW line of product. It's just a shame that so many are so keen to bash Fanatec to death over a minimal failure rate.

No-one likes to hand over hard earned dollars for a product that for whatever reason fails, we humans are fickle animals, and when something doesn't work out or fails to perform as expected, we can be very vindictive, nasty and opinionated, I'm guilty of this behavior myself, but I also realise that nothing is prefect, just like Fanatec products, their not perfect, yet. But they are the closest thing to reality for feel and immersion that I have found. And yes Ive had issues with the F1 rim and the CSS SQ, but they were resolved quickly and without fuss, for me, the only annoying part of the warranty process is being without the wheel or shifter, but it only takes on average 3 weeks to receive the replacement here in Australia, once they receive the faulty product.

I have every faith in Fanatec's products and will continue to use and recommend them to other simracers who are looking for quality sim gear

Cheers

I agree some people go off the rails bashing companies but it must be said when you drop the kind of coin on their products you expect to have these issues figured out faster than this.

 

[RaceNut]

Yeah but, the price thing is relative. For some it may as well be a fortune, for others it's a drop in the bucket. With the top of the line wheel running $4000, the Fanatec doesn't seem all that expensive - so long as it works. That's where the true value is determined and is an unknown going in.

 

[Leemstradamus]

Yeah but, the price thing is relative. For some it may as well be a fortune, for others it's a drop in the bucket. With the top of the line wheel running $4000, the Fanatec doesn't seem all that expensive - so long as it works. That's where the true value is determined and is an unknown going in.

True but the top end wheels are low volume. So they have to cost more to make it a worth while venture. 4k on a wheel I can safely say is light years out of my budget lol!

 

[Tobbe Bergman]

Yeah but, the price thing is relative. For some it may as well be a fortune, for others it's a drop in the bucket. With the top of the line wheel running $4000, the Fanatec doesn't seem all that expensive - so long as it works. That's where the true value is determined and is an unknown going in.

No sim wheel is worth 4 grand !

 

[RaceNut]

True but the top end wheels are low volume. So they have to cost more to make it a worth while venture. 4k on a wheel I can safely say is light years out of my budget lol!

I agree, it is for me as well but, when the AccuForce is available, I may have to consider selling my CSW and going that route if the SimExperience wheel turns out as well as early signs suggest. That wheel is said to be priced just under $2000. That's still a lot of money but, at some point, eliminating the frustration that comes with dealing with repeated warranty issues is justified.

 

[RaceNut]

No sim wheel is worth 4 grand !

Yes I agree, even if it has the power to rotate the whole world around it.

 

[Leemstradamus]

I'm with you @RaceNut . I'm thinking of going down that route but what is going to take me quite some time to get saved up are the different wheels that I would need to attach to that base. I was just looking at an F1 replica wheel on our forums that will cost almost $2350 just for that wheel! And I will also need a GT3 wheel and a touring car wheel lol. That's why at this moment the clubsport line-up does show great value.

I am really impressed by what Bernie is doing, I like that they offer full setups and still have the diy kits too.

 

[Tobbe Bergman]

No sim wheel is worth 2 grand

FYI My complete sim rig ( Excluding Monitors and PC ) is just above 2 grand

 

[Tim Meuris]

I agree, it is for me as well but, when the AccuForce is available, I may have to consider selling my CSW and going that route if the SimExperience wheel turns out as well as early signs suggest. That wheel is said to be priced just under $2000. That's still a lot of money but, at some point, eliminating the frustration that comes with dealing with repeated warranty issues is justified.

I'm waiting for this wheel as well. It looks promising. Another option is to go with the complete clubsport line which looks good and gives good feedback but I would be scared when pressing the orderingbutton. When reading all those stories it sometimes look like they have a lemon business. But when it works I think the clubsport line as a whole offers great value.

 

[Tobbe Bergman]

I'm waiting for this wheel as well. It looks promising. Another option is to go with the complete clubsport line which looks good and gives good feedback but I would be scared when pressing the orderingbutton. When reading all those stories it sometimes look like they have a lemon business. But when it works I think the clubsport line as a whole offers great value.

All those stories

How many stories is it ? 20, 50, 100 ?

How many have been sold ?

Probably thousands !

 

[RaceNut]

Yes, I love the ClubSport but, it is a little uncomfortable knowing that the motors can be a potential issue. Having the upgrade kit in hand should help alleviate that feeling. Until then, fingers and toes crossed.

 

[RaceNut]

All those stories

How many stories is it ? 20, 50, 100 ?

How many have been sold ?

Probably thousands !

True but, how many issues go unreported? How many people just get frustrated and give up putting the wheel on a shelf, tossing it or just keep quiet about it? Only Fanatec can say what the failure rate is but, the motors are clearly a weak link and we can only go by what those with the right knowledge are saying. That is - these motors are not designed to take the kind of stress that this application demands - period. Motors, both working and failed are disassembled and inspected and the evidence clearly supports it. Recent firmware changes support it.

I purchased the CSW anyway because I felt that there just wasn't a better fit for me and there would be the option to upgrade the motors down the line. In the event the motors fail, I would pursue having them replaced under warranty but, I also want to know that I'd have a better option down the line as well. In the meantime, I run with FFB in-game at 70% or less and always pay attention to the air temp coming out of the base.

 

[Tobbe Bergman]

True but, how many issues go unreported? How many people just get frustrated and give up putting the wheel on a shelf, tossing it or just keep quiet about it? Only Fanatec can say what the failure rate is but, the motors are clearly a weak link and we can only go by what those with the right knowledge are saying. That is - these motors are not designed to take the kind of stress that this application demands - period. Motors, both working and failed are disassembled and inspected and the evidence clearly supports it. Recent firmware changes support it.

I purchased the CSW anyway because I felt that there just wasn't a better fit for me and there would be the option to upgrade the motors down the line. In the event the motors fail, I would pursue having them replaced under warranty but, I also want to know that I'd have a better option down the line as well. In the meantime, I run with FFB in-game at 70% or less and always pay attention to the air temp coming out of the base.

In Assetto Corsa I have FFB ingame @ 100 and on the wheel also @ 100 ( FOR and FFB ) and the air coming out on the right side has never been more than luke warm even after long sessions.

 

[RaceNut]

I had a heat problem with 70% in-game/100 on CSW while running the Z4. The air got quite warm and I could smell the motor getting hot. I solved this by using wheel presets at lower force settings for use with different cars.

 

[SteffenLS]

I run my CSW at 100/70 wheel/game and have seen nothing yet when it comes to heatproblems ...

 

[Leemstradamus]

I run my CSW at 100/70 wheel/game and have seen nothing yet when it comes to heatproblems ...

I did the same and it was fine until two weeks ago. I started to notice very heavy ffb fade after a while and it got worse and worse. Then I started having this almost clicking noise coming from the motors. All the while the temperature form the vents was never that warm. Barley above ambient actually. Finally the motor gave out when turning right. You could see the numbers on the wheel fading out and it would just cut out mid turn.

 

[Tim Meuris]

Yes, I love the ClubSport but, it is a little uncomfortable knowing that the motors can be a potential issue. Having the upgrade kit in hand should help alleviate that feeling. Until then, fingers and toes crossed.

wait wut? is there an official upgradekit?

 

[RaceNut]

wait wut? is there an official upgradekit?

No - nothing official, simply some modders working together sharing information and developing a kind of solution for the motor issues. They use Buhler's that are better quality motors but, they do require some machine work along with the motor mount and pulleys. They also are experimenting with cooling solutions and different voltages to increase the power of the CSW. Without upping the voltage, the Buhler's are reported to be a bit stronger but, also very reliable. An auxiliary air-pump can be used to pump ambient air directly through the motor cans to keep them running cool at higher voltages for those who want higher FFB than stock. The motors are said to also offer more force than stock without clipping. That's not to say they don't clip - they still do but, at higher force settings.

View this Thread

 

[Leemstradamus]

No - nothing official, simply some modders working together sharing information and developing a kind of solution for the motor issues. They use Buhler's that are better quality motors but, they do require some machine work along with the motor mount and pulleys. They also are experimenting with cooling solutions and different voltages to increase the power of the CSW. Without upping the voltage, the Buhler's are reported to be a bit stronger but, also very reliable. An auxiliary air-pump can be used to pump ambient air directly through the motor cans to keep them running cool at higher voltages for those who want higher FFB than stock. The motors are said to also offer more force than stock without clipping. That's not to say they don't clip - they still do but, at higher force settings.

View this Thread

I've been following that thread for a while also. It was the reason I went ahead and got the CSW line. hope they get to a drop in replacement solution.

 

[RaceNut]

In Assetto Corsa I have FFB ingame @ 100 and on the wheel also @ 100 ( FOR and FFB ) and the air coming out on the right side has never been more than luke warm even after long sessions.

Keep in mind that the temps inside the motor cans is much higher than the air coming off the heatsink. That's where the damage occurs to the windings, brushes and magnets. Running cool air directly through the motor cans has been shown to improve cooling and reliability - even with the stock motors. Chances are, if the motors get hot enough to create the smell - heat damage to the motors is occurring. By the time you realize there might be an issue, the damage is already done.

The damage can occur very fast in extreme cases or it can be cumulative and take longer. It depends on the particular motors and how they are used.