Intel 13th Gen CPU's

Interesting, but I think I'll wait to see the benchmarks from Gamer's Nexus and others.

My gut reaction is that he was pushing for a clickbait outcome. In a couple days we will know more.
Not at all. Frame Chasers is probably the most honest PC reviewer on Youtube. This guy has no sponsors, has no hardware that companies give to him to review, and has no agenda other than just honest "proper" reporting. He also never cares what company / part wins. He has also exposed & called-out big tech-tubers like Hardware Unboxed and Jays2cents with things like biased or scripted reviews, unfair and just simply stupid ways of testing which makes products look worse/better than they really are VS other products.

He often even admits when he does clickbait pics or titles for his videos. He jokes around about it in a satirical way because of how it's sad that so much good content isn't viewed by people if they don't have clickbait pics/titles. In this case, though, the pic is hardly clickbait as the 13900K is almost 0% better than the 12900K.

He'll have a bigger, more in-depth review sometime this week. I just hope he uses a 4090 instead of a 3090 Ti for his full review so that the CPUs are allowed to breath as much as possible.

If you read specs from a reputable source, you see a large clock speed improvement up to 5.8GHz for cores 1 and 2, and 5.5GHz for cores 3-8,as well as a 5-11% latency improvements between the L1,L2,L3 cache with a chunk larger cache.
Single core should be about 12% faster and multi-core 41% faster even if that doesn't matter a lot to us. Most estimates are 10-15% improvement in gaming performance.
Exactly. That's why those gaming results are underwhelming. Plus, I'd believe real life tests over marketing and numbers the manufacturer tells us. Furthermore, the single-threaded specs don't mean anything. When does your CPU go into single-thread boost? For 0.1 second while idling or loading Windows? CPUs never achieve single-core boost speeds under heavy loads in games. It's all crap that's good for nothing but marketing and synthetic benchmark scores.

I was hoping for much more improvements as well due to having more cache and a higher all-core frequency.

Frame Chasers used a 13900K at 5.6 GHz all-core, 5.0 GHz cache, e-cores disabled for even more P-core cache (since the e-cores normally steal some of the P-Cores' cache), 6800 MHz CL32 DDR5 RAM (faster than probably 98% of people's RAM setups), and a 3090 Ti. He gave the 13900K an extremely good chance.

The workloads that take advantage of the extra e-cores, like some rendering programs and other sorts of productivity programs - you know, "work" stuff - along with synthetic benchmarks (Cinebench, 3D Mark CPU tests, etc.) will definitely show a noticeable improvement but that means little-to-nothing for gaming.

We'll see how things unfold and hopefully things look better for the 13900K in future tests but Frame Chasers is not doing anything dishonest or deceitful in his testing.
 
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Seems we have some contradictions. Granted this is for multi-threaded performance not single. ( They ignored the fact that the AMD on the graph did just as well at only 65W )

Intel Core i9-13900K Raptor Lake CPU Offers Same Performance As Core i9-12900K With “Unlimited Power” at Just 80W​

It's kinda perverse though for them not to clarify the scaling by showing the performance of the 12900K at 65 or 80 W...
 
Yeah.. blame " Enthusiast Citizen " for that... It seems that Intel forced some "Show this and not that" to all reviewers etc :(
That's why I think "Frame Chasers" is a hidden gem. The guy doesn't give a ****. He tests every thing to the best of it's ability. Doesn't skew results, doesn't try to hide other results, no B.S. Just an honest guy with nobody to please, no sponsors, no product review samples, nothing. The funds he uses to buy and review hardware are all from himself and Patreon (or Discord?) people and, not just that, but he knows what he's doing.

Sorry, I hate to keep going on about "Frame Chasers" but watching him and his videos over the past 6 months or so has really shed a lot of light on how PC hardware truly performs in the real world VS the mainstream tech-tubers. "Frame Chasers" gives you the real numbers. Another hidden gem is "Actual Hardcore Overclocking". He's more about deep analysis of motherboard and GPU PCBs and RAM overclocking/tuning though.
 
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Edit: 4,000Mhz appears to be working now, so the bios update was worth it for that alone.

Out of curiosity: is that in Gear 1 or Gear 2 mode ? I'm assuming it's standard XMP in Gear 2 ?

My G.Skill 4000 CL15-16-16-36 (Samsung B-Die) runs at advertised speeds/timings on my Asus Strix Z690-A/12900K with XMP enabled, but only in Gear 2 (and 1T command rate, oddly enough).

My IMC can handle 3600 in Gear 1, so I manually tuned my RAM to run at 3600 CL14-14-14-28 in Gear 1, with 288 tRFC (instead of the rediculously high tRFC set by XMP) and other secondary and tertiary timings as tight as they will go. But: at 2T command rate, it won't even boot at 1T...
I prefer the lower latency of Gear 1 vs 2 to the small performance loss between 1T and 2T command rate though. This yields better CPU scores in 3DMark et al, and my system feels "snappier" overall.
 
I'll check, but I know that I managed Gear 1 at 3800MHz. I think I did accidentally go to the default XMP for 4,000MHz

For 12900K to 13900K Gaming
  • Counter-Strike: Global Offensive: + 11.85%
  • Rainbow Six Siege: + 3.2%
  • TombRaider: + 4.8%
  • Far Cry 6: + 11.4%

CyberPunk 1.6 showed 15% better performance with a 4090 than with a 7950X

 
2F79AAE4-00D4-49C3-8600-0594F320422B.jpeg
 
What I took from those two screen shots is that the i9-13900K was 18% faster than the i9-12900K driving the RTX 4090 and the DRAM didn't factor into things much.

Take the earlier Gamers Nexus number with a 15% improvement with the 4090 between 12900 and 13900 and things are looking very good for that pairing :)

REALLY hoping these numbers carry through for DCS !!!!!
 
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  • Deleted member 197115

Wait, D4-3600 vs D5-6400 are almost identical performance?
Still not sure I'll go AMD route.
 
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Some valid points but with the release of 13th gen the socket becomes EOL. With five years of future support AM5 offers more value than is immediately obvious.

And having seen how well the 5800x3d on ddr4 stands up to these new offerings it doesn't take a genius to understand that if the 7800x3d were available today it would be dominating those gaming charts.
 
Some very interesting data there. The 13600K looks pretty great for value (if a little power-hungry/hot but a bit of clock/voltage tweaking ought to help that I'm sure).

But maybe the most interesting bit for me was the test of Intel's astonishing "On Par" claim for a 65 W 13900K vs the 241 W 12900K. Bluntly, it's not the case:
1666380276387.png

1666380332047.png

OK, the small print says that Intel did their test with SPECint, but it feels like they were pretty disingenuous about it. Bad show, Intel.
 
Some very interesting data there. The 13600K looks pretty great for value (if a little power-hungry/hot but a bit of clock/voltage tweaking ought to help that I'm sure).

But maybe the most interesting bit for me was the test of Intel's astonishing "On Par" claim for a 65 W 13900K vs the 241 W 12900K. Bluntly, it's not the case:
View attachment 610517
View attachment 610518
OK, the small print says that Intel did their test with SPECint, but it feels like they were pretty disingenuous about it. Bad show, Intel.
German pcgameshardware did some very nice charts for us interested not only the most fps or the best fps/price ratio but also in the fps/watt ratio.
I only selected the value CPUs here, since for simracing the higher end CPUs have a very worse value...

Dying Light 2, one of the few games where the X3D scales very strongly, like in acc:
IMG_20221021_233036_395.jpg


12 game average power consumption:
IMG_20221021_233038_733.jpg


FPS per Watt, 5600X being the best and therefore 100%:
IMG_20221021_233042_349.jpg


A general overview about some amd eco mode (65W) or Intel with 85W limit. Sadly not CPUs selectable so it's quite a mess:
IMG_20221021_114053_330.png




What's the most interesting for me:
How will the 13400 or even 13100 compare against the 12600k and 12400F. What will be the best value motherboard and how much better will the price to performance ratio be compared to the 5800x3D and 7600x and how will the power efficiency end up.

B650 mobos are slowly creeping onto the market and amd will have to lower the price of the 7600x soon.
I hope Intel will release the lower end i3 and i5 soon. Looks very promising!

Depending on the data, it might make sore sense to get a 13400 + cheapo motherboard and ddr4 now and maybe get an AMD 8600 non-x in 1,5-2 years than to invest into AM5 now and miss out on nice features like direct storage 2.0 or whatever might be around then.
 
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Just about any 12900K should be able to do DDR4 4000 CL 14-15 with fully tuned primary, secondary, and tertiary timings. 4100-4133 CL 15 is often doable too, 4200 - 4266 CL16 is quite tough/rare but some (eg. mine) can do it, even with dual-rank sticks.

If you're running DDR4 gear 2, I hope it's with crazy 4800-5200 MHz Ram or else gear 2 will just be providing a fairly big performance hit in games.

 
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