4 GRAN PREMIO DE SUGO

[Mike Simian]

I think the problem is having a green flag before people can overtake which causes potential problems.

What happens now is everyone accelerates at green flag only to have to check their speed so as not to overtake befor the S/F line, this causes all the chain reactions.

Its not the first time this has happened and I think a modification of the rule could help.

Start Proceedure:
Idea 1, Later Green flag - overtake before SF.

Pace car moves to the pits, lead car keeps same pace.
Green flag message is shown after the lead car crosses the S/F line.
(however its the lead car crossing the S/F line that marks the start of the race, not the Green flag, the Green flag is there to show the rest of the field that the lead car has crossed the line and the race is live)
At this point the race is live. Everyone can accelerate and overtake.

Idea 2 - Green Flag, Race on.

Simple one, drop the rule about the S/F line.
Pace car moves to the pits, lead car keeps the same pace.
On the green flag message the race is live, all cars can accelerate and overtake.


Theres more variations, I'm sure someone could add to them, refine them, think of a better one, to find the perfect starting proceedure.

What do you think STC, could we have some discussion on this? We dont need to rush anything, maybe something for the next seasons.

 

[Gregory Degreef]

+1 for idea2

 

[Simon Melhuish]

+2 for idea 2

 

[Tom Ilsbroux]

Dropping the no passing works great if all the cars are lined up and driving at the same pace.
We shouldn't allow drivers trying to predict the green flag and speeding up early.

 

[Tom Ilsbroux]

These are 2 vids i made last season from the start at Bahrain. Taken from both flatout cars.

As you can see it was a messy start, mainly because cars where not lined up properly. Only because the track is so wide there wasn't a pile up.

 

[Peter Carlsson]

what´s the problem with standing start????? all have the same chance... same for all.... yea its a big risk at T1 but what is better....???

I think the pacecar should go before last turn and polesitter makes the start at last turn.... works every time !!!! hehe or not!!
always gonna be problems but standing start is equal to everyone...

 

[Simon Melhuish]

I think the main reason for issues is having the safety car in the first place and having a million messages on the screen before the race. Your driving along and your reading whats being said then before you know it all the cars have slowed down.

 

[Mike Simian]

I like the Safety Car, it adds to the overall feel of the event. Sure it was an ambitious addition knowing EVO is the platform.

I don't think the Saftey Car has anything to do with what happens at race start, by that time its long gone. Besides everyone should know the SC proceedure by now, its not too difficult, all you have to do is stay behind the car in front and dont leave too much gap....only message you need to see after that is the Green Flag.

Having said that, it is the starting proceedure thats at fault here, its all a bit too much with EVOs limited ability. I think we can smooth it out quite quickly with eg dropping the S/F rule. Then ofcource we are going to be moving to rF2 whenever that arrives, sooner rather than later I hope, and I'm sure theres going to be much more options.

 

[David Garcia]

These are 2 vids i made last season from the start at Bahrain.

OK Tom, in my opinion you have pointed at the main problem with that last post quoting the Bahrain videos. So, in my opinion the problems are:

1. Circuit having a fast corner as last corner as Sugo or Bahrain. Having a chicane or a slow corner is a kind of filter to set the race on green as it will set a little gap from car to car accelerating out of this corner, and then it will make things easier to race direction to set the race on green.
2. People trying to guess the green flag message and get closer to the car infront before the race is on green. If I type millions of times (...as Simon said...) the KEEP THE PACE & FORMATION message, I mean keep it until the GREEN FLAG message and not until the main straight comes. If no one accelerates until watching the GREEN FLAG message on screen, we will have no further problems.
3. It is very important the race leader following the Safety Car goes on a constant pace, so if the Safety Car accelerates and goes back to pit faster to open a gap, the race can be set on green earlier. At Sugo Marcin did great, that was just my fault going a bit late on pit.
4. And as last point, droping the start/finish line overtaking rule would be very unfair in my opinion. As an example at 80% of the STC circuits and without that rule, some guys would be at the chicane/slow corner with clear overtaking options when the others would be on a straight without any, so to me keeping the s/f line rule is important. Just accelerate when the green flag message comes, it is a 90 minutes race. Even with that I am up to drop that rule if you really think it is better.

Any more suggestions?

As Mike has pointed out, I think the Safety Car makes the series more real and exclusive, specially being at Evo wich is such a hand made work. Apart of it, we have proved it to work during 5 consecutive seassons now, but of course it can be improved. We only have to point at the right direction.

Then ofcource we are going to be moving to rF2 whenever that arrives, sooner rather than later I hope, and I'm sure theres going to be much more options.

I hope it is sooner than later... we are alredy working on it. :tongue:

 

[Mike Simian]

OK Tom, in my opinion you have pointed at the main problem with that last post quoting the Bahrain videos. So, in my opinion the problems are:

1. Circuit having a fast corner as last corner as Sugo or Bahrain. Having a chicane or a slow corner is a kind of filter to set the race on green as it will set a little gap from car to car accelerating out of this corner, and then it will make things easier to race direction to set the race on green.
2. People trying to guess the green flag message and get closer to the car infront before the race is on green. If I type millions of times (...as Simon said...) the KEEP THE PACE & FORMATION message, I mean keep it until the GREEN FLAG message and not until the main straight comes. If no one accelerates until watching the GREEN FLAG message on screen, we will have no further problems.
3. It is very important the race leader following the Safety Car goes on a constant pace, so if the Safety Car accelerates and goes back to pit faster to open a gap, the race can be set on green earlier. At Sugo Marcin did great, that was just my fault going a bit late on pit.
4. And as last point, droping the start/finish line overtaking rule would be very unfair in my opinion. As an example at 80% of the STC circuits and without that rule, some guys would be at the chicane/slow corner with clear overtaking options when the others would be on a straight without any, so to me keeping the s/f line rule is important. Just accelerate when the green flag message comes, it is a 90 minutes race. Even with that I am up to drop that rule if you really think it is better.

Any more suggestions?

As Mike has pointed out, I think the Safety Car makes the series more real and exclusive, specially being at Evo wich is such a hand made work. Apart of it, we have proved it to work during 5 consecutive seassons now, but of course it can be improved. We only have to point at the right direction.




I hope it is sooner than later... we are alredy working on it. :tongue:

(Edit) If you did drop the S/F rule then a new rule should be added, no overtaking before exiting the last corner. That should then make everything fair, everyone has an opportunity from either a good exit of the last corner and a slipstream, entry to t1 or both.

I think dropping the S/F rule will make things slightly easier, will add some more exitment to the first turn no doubt. The problem as you identified David, is some drivers are not keeping tight formation and are trying to gain advantage by leaving a big gap and guessing the green flag. The only way to stop that I guess is to monitor the starts, and hand out points penaltys to anyone doing that. That would mean more work for the staff however

I think most importantly is the Green Flag is the start of the race proper. When the Green Flag is out, all can accelerate and overtake, the race is live. Obviously Race Control can hold the Green Flag until it sees a good formation even if thats half way around the track

 

[Michael Hart-Jones]

The problem as you identified David, is some drivers are not keeping tight formation and are trying to gain advantage by leaving a big gap and guessing the green flag. The only way to stop that I guess is to monitor the starts, and hand out points penaltys to anyone doing that. That would mean more work for the staff however

This was all that saved us nearer the back from joining in the large pile of cars. I will not meantion names but someone was a good distance behind the pack and was accelerating for a good start when the greens should have been called.

On a plus note, the quality of driving this race was so much better. Thanks for the good clean racing guys, and close battles too. I thought those poor commentators were going to loose their voices', I heard Xose being denied his beer and food break.

 

[Marcin Skrzypczak]

Guys guys guys The rules are clear and simple, its only drivers fault that they cant do it properly ONLY

 

[Göran Johansson]

I totally agree with Marcin

 

[Michael Hart-Jones]

From the guy at the back.

@Marcin

 

[Gregory Degreef]

Guys guys guys The rules are clear and simple, its only drivers fault that they cant do it properly ONLY

looool

 

[Tom Ilsbroux]

Guys guys guys The rules are clear and simple, its only drivers fault that they cant do it properly ONLY

lool, kinda why there are rules

 

[Tom Ilsbroux]

It all comes down to everyone beeing lined up properly without big gaps, then dropping the no overtaking rule wouldn't be a problem either and it would still be fair.

 

[David Garcia]

EDITED!

 

[David Garcia]

CORRECTION TO MY PREVIOUS POST: We will keep the system as usual with the start/finish line overtaking rule.

We will mention some points on the briefing regarding the correct procedure.

 

[Marcin Skrzypczak]

good